Equine Assisted World with Rupert Isaacson

Rupert Isaacson: Welcome
to Equine Assisted World.

I'm your host, Rupert Isaacson.

New York Times bestselling
author of the Horse Boy.

Founder of New Trails Learning
Systems and long ride home.com.

You can find details of all our programs
and shows on Rupert isaacson.com.

Here on Equine Assisted World.

We look at the cutting edge and the best
practices currently being developed and,

established in the equine assisted field.

This can be psychological, this
can be neuropsych, this can be

physical, this can be all of the
conditions that human beings have.

These lovely equines, these beautiful
horses that we work with, help us with.

Thank you for being part of the adventure
and we hope you enjoy today's show

Welcome back to Equine Assisted World.

I've got someone amazing.

I always have someone amazing.

Cheryl Bartow.

Cheryl Bartow runs Smiling Goat Ranch.

She'll be really ranchers in
the western slope of Colorado.

She's an autism mum She's been running
an extraordinary equestrian assisted

I say equestrian assisted not equine
assisted because she brings a lot

of beautiful classical writing and
education to what she does and with

special needs and also to special horses.

She's invested many, many years
in acquiring this knowledge.

And as a result does something rather
extraordinary, not just for people with

autism, but also people with trauma
and people who are lost in the world.

And she does it in an area of Colorado
that a lot of people are, are Less

familiar with everyone's heard of Aspen.

Oh, yeah, all these rich people in Aspen
Well, they don't realize is that it's a

whole hinterground on the Western Slope
of very very ordinary people Living out

their lives sort of ranchers people with
jobs and so on all of these people end

up with special needs kids and Someone's
got a servant Cheryl Bartow is the person

who and has been there for many years.

She's not just limited to the horses.

She also includes mountain sports.

She just includes ranch work,
ranch life, life skills.

I'm going to stop babbling.

But Cheryl Bartow makes me
babble because she's so awesome.

Okay.

So Cheryl, welcome to
Equine Assisted World.

Would you please tell us a bit
about who you are and what you do?

Sheryl Barto: Thank you, Rupert.

I am incredibly honored to be
here and talking with you today.

Wow.

That was quite the introduction.

And yes, I started Smiling Goat in 2015
and As you mentioned, I'm an autism mom,

and that's where this journey started.

My son, James, is now 30 years old,
and we didn't get a diagnosis until

he was 10, but we knew something was
up during those first 10 years, and

gosh, I I was Grew up really wanting
to be a horse trainer and that's what

I wanted to do when I went to college.

And I am the product of a divorced family.

And my mom was a single mom.

My dad was still very much in my life.

He was a veterinarian.

But my mom said, you absolutely are not
going to college to be a horse trainer

and I ended up getting a degree in
journalism and pursuing a career in public

relations and gosh, for probably 25 years.

I had no horses in my life.

I I grew up showing POAs from like
age 12 through 18, and then I was

on the writing team in college.

Rupert Isaacson: What's a
POA for we Brits out there?

Sheryl Barto: Pony of America.

Rupert Isaacson: Okay.

Sheryl Barto: Yes.

That's

Rupert Isaacson: a pretty
close thing, right?

Yeah.

Sheryl Barto: They are mini Appaloosas.

So they're under 14, two hands.

So they're technically a ponies, but
they have brains more like horses.

So they're not, they're smaller.

They're not evil, right?

They're not evil.

No, they're, they're really, really sweet.

And my journey, my, my POA, my
pony was named Tomahawks Supreme.

And I called him Supreme and I really
grew up with him like those were the

days, of course, with no cell phones,
or, you know, I would say to my

mom, I'm going out for a trail ride.

I would take Supreme and the dog and I
would be gone for 8 hours and I would

Rupert Isaacson: switch part of the US.

Sheryl Barto: In Pennsylvania in between
Reading and Lancaster, Pennsylvania.

So lots of farm country.

My dad had started out being
a large and small animal vet.

So many of the farms I had already
visited because he was doing farm

calls and pregnancy checks on dairy
cattle and I would just ride by myself.

And, you know, being part, being
a product of a divorced family,

there's lots of stuff you go through.

And that pony, I feel like saved
my mental health going through, you

know, the teenage years of having
divorced parents and remarriages and

step Brothers and sisters and all that
good stuff that now seems very common.

When I left college with my
journalism degree, I had done an

internship in PR for IBM at a federal
systems division in New York State.

And I really thought, okay, I'm
going to be a corporate PR person

and I'm going to get a job in a
corporation doing PR because I loved

my internship and I had learned so
much in the 6 months that I was there.

At the same time, I still
had a relationship going with

my high school sweetheart.

And he was in the Coast
Guard and stationed in Hawaii

and then in New England.

And we always had had this
dream of going to Colorado.

And I think, you know, Colorado had
this magnetic allure of we were both

skiers, wanted to be in the mountains.

And I, my 1st job ended up not being with
a corporation, but being with a local

government association in Harrisburg,
Pennsylvania, which is the capital of

the state and pretty pretty city like,
which was really not my jam, but I was

hired to work on a local government
magazine that represented the whole state.

So I was reporter, photographer, etc.

And in the meantime, Two of my high
school friends went to Aspen, Colorado

after they graduated just to have fun.

And I went out to visit them because
we all shared this love of skiing.

And I thought, Oh my
gosh, what am I doing?

I'm 22 years old.

I'm quitting my job and I'm moving
to Aspen, which is what I did.

And I became a ski bum for a season.

thinking I would go
back to the real world.

And I ended up then getting a job
in PR with the Aspen Skiing Company.

So I stayed the summer.

And once you experience a summer in
Colorado, they always say you come for

the winter, you stay for the summers.

And this is a lot of people's
stories here in Why is that?

The summer is incredibly magical.

The weather is spectacular.

It's almost perfection.

There's sunny days, everybody's out
hiking or mountain biking, and you the

ski areas have turned summer tourism
into this incredible attraction.

And honestly, in Aspen on July 4th.

They do an old town parade and it
is more crowded on July 4th in Aspen

than any day during the winter time.

It's there's, there's
a lot of magic to it.

Yeah.

And so I ended up marrying my high
school sweetheart and we had two

sons and The oldest son, James, is
Our kiddo on the autism spectrum

and he's very high functioning.

We got the diagnosis when he was 10 and
as I mentioned earlier, we didn't know

what was going on age 2 through 10,
but we knew something was going on and.

I had gone to specialist after specialist.

We are three hours from Denver.

We had seen three different doctors
in Denver and people would say,

gosh, this is, this is a puzzle.

Is it ADD?

Is it ADHD?

And I would say, yeah, I see pieces
and parts of that, but I don't.

Think that that's it.

And then crazily, and I don't think
I've ever shared this story with

you in my PR world, I represented
import beer companies for 15 years.

And it was a really fun gig, which
meant that I took us journalists

to breweries throughout Europe.

So Germany, the Czech Republic,
Ireland, even Thailand.

And one of these trips, I had a
female editor and it was a magazine.

I don't even remember
the name of it anymore.

But it was 1 of those, like, Maxim
magazines and a female editor.

And I was like, really?

I always thought men would be the
editors of those magazines, but she and

I are still in touch to this day and.

She told me this story of her sister being
diagnosed with autism and we were on a

bus going from a brewery to town to tour
and I got home and I started researching

autism and I spent a weekend like just
getting sucked in and realizing this was

it and calling my dad, the veterinarian,
and saying, I think we figured this out.

And at the time.

Children's hospital, Colorado had an
8 month waiting list to you have to in

Colorado have a psychiatrist make your
diagnosis and so 8 months later, we went

to children's and they said, no, we You
have a textbook case, a son with autism.

And there were such emotions around
that of relief of knowing what we were

dealing with to sadness to, Oh my gosh,
like I don't have a neurotypical kid.

And being in a small town, we were
the only people James actually ended

up being the first person from his
high school graduating with autism.

And so I took the path of Owning it and
telling everyone and educating people

when we got the diagnosis, he was going
from elementary school into middle school.

And I called the principal
of the middle school.

And I said, this is what I just learned.

And he said, will you come in and do a
presentation to the whole teaching team?

And so I came in, did a presentation to.

The whole fifth grade teaching
team, and it was amazing how they

open their arms and welcome James
and really made accommodations for

him to get through middle school.

And then we get into high school
and it's a completely different ball

game, different Well, we're, you
know, he has to advocate for himself

and he needs to do X, Y, and Z.

And it was for me as a parent, a huge
struggle and dealing with bullying,

dealing with being ostracized and not
like, One of the gifts of autism, I,

there are so many which I learned through
you and the horse boy method is not

really caring what other people think
and, you know, I'm seeing where he's

not getting invited to the graduation
parties or any parties for that matter.

And he's blissfully happy with
his world of, you know, us having

a dog and that dog was his.

Lifeline his, you know, looking back
on all of this and not realizing how

much the dog was his lifeline until I
went through the horse boy method and

understanding that animal connection
with, with humans and special needs folks.

So, gosh, then.

Yeah, my PR career is going parallel
with all this whole journey and my

career has really taken off and my
business is doing really, really well.

And I end up.

going through a divorce
because I was the breadwinner.

And it was a lot.

It was a lot, being the breadwinner
and a special needs mom.

And frankly, I look back on that Era
and say to myself, you should have still

made room for horses, but I felt like
I couldn't financially or time wise.

And then while, when James was 15, this
local autism group said to me, Let's have

him come to our camp for this session.

And that was when my son learned that
he had autism, not until he was 15.

He didn't even realize, and
it didn't matter to him.

He was very happy in his own world.

And when they had so graciously offered
to allow him to be part of the camp, I

said, well, how can I give back to you?

And And that's when I offered to
do the pro bono work for them and

they were a growing organization.

I think they are now in their 20th year.

Rupert Isaacson: What's the
name of the organization?

Sheryl Barto: It's called a syndigo
and at the time it was called extreme

sports camp and that had a lot of
mixed messages in the marketplace,

especially in a ski town where there's
actually like extreme ski sports.

But the idea of their organization
is to actually teach people

on the autism spectrum.

Skills to do sports.

So they were doing rock climbing,
they were doing horseback riding,

and they were doing water sports.

So, wakeboarding.

And it was really cool.

They had video footage of my son, who
we had gone with friends to Lake Powell.

With, of course, all my friend's kids
are neurotypical kids and their kids are

doing flips on the wakeboards and one
arms and going sideways, you know, and

James could never do that and he gets
to this camp and he's the star on the

wakeboard because he had seen what some
of the other kids had done and he did

what he could do to his level and like,
the Photos of him and the grin on his

face of the accomplishments that he had
at this camp were absolutely priceless.

So then they, as an organization,
evolved into wanting to do Big

gala fundraiser, and that's when
they decided they were going to

bring in celebrity autism parents.

And they brought in Holly Robinson
Pete, who is the star of 21 Jump

Street, and her husband is an
ex NFL football player Rodney B.

And then they brought in Rupert
Isaacson, the founder of the horse boy.

And I remember thinking, how
can I have been a horse obsessed

person and have never heard of
the horse boy book or movie.

And I have a son with autism.

And my conclusion to that was, well,
I was a single mom running a business,

raising a kid with special needs.

And so.

When I witnessed your demonstration
of the horse boy method on a horse

you had never met in a place you had
never been to and how you were teaching

geography and math from the back of
a horse, I was moved to tears and I

thought, Oh my gosh, this is my calling.

And this is what I'm supposed to be doing.

And, and I, and I think
Rupert, that was 2012.

So I had no horses, no infrastructure,
no no, nothing other than a

PR firm and a new husband.

Who had and I came home and I
said, you know, I, how do you feel

about having horses in our lives?

And he had grown up in Wyoming
on a ranch and he had 2 kids

and he said, I'm open to it.

So we had had a small property.

Well, I should back up because I want
to talk a little bit about the horse

boy karma that I think has followed
me completely on this journey.

So James graduates high school and.

All he's seeing all of his friends
go off to college and James

absolutely was not college material,
nor did he want to go to college.

So I had researched a life skills
school, like, where could he go?

To learn some more life skills.

So I had found one in Arizona and at
the time because I didn't have enough

to do, I was the volunteer journalism
teacher at their local high school

because I didn't like the newspaper and
I thought it could be so much better.

And it was a way for me to
get back to the high school.

I did not want to be on boosters.

I did not want to be in any sort
of politics and I was like, why

don't I try teaching this class?

So I'm teaching this class.

I did it for the three years.

Both my boys were in the high school
and a journalism fellowship came across

my desk after you had been to Aspen
for this event and you could apply

for two weeks to Enhance your skills
as a high school journalism teacher.

So I was like, Oh my gosh, university
or Arizona state was on the list.

And I thought I'll apply there.

I will go.

Then I can be down there with James
while he's attending life skills school.

And then I get a rejection letter from
Arizona, but they said, we're happy to

host you at university of Texas in Austin.

And I was like, Oh, wait a minute.

Isn't that where Rupert's
whole program is based?

Well, maybe I should go visit while I'm
down there and see if this is the real

deal and see if it is what I think it is.

And so I ended up going to Austin and in
my two weeks we had a free weekend and I

went out to visit Horseboy headquarters,
which at the time was in Elgin, Texas.

And I don't know if you remember
this visit, Rupert, but I met

Betsy, the foundation horse.

And I also remember really having this
fear, even though I was an autism mom.

of other people's kids with autism.

Like would I be able to handle them?

Would I know what to do?

Would I be worthy?

Could I really help them?

Like it was, so it was weird that I
was having this Awesome experience

teaching kids at the high school,
but they're all neurotypical kids.

I have this autistic son and then
I come to your ranch in Elgin and

I remember this family from Mexico
being there and they had three kids.

You were working with the
entire family and their little

boy was severely autistic.

Watching him with the horses and
you somehow had me jump in while

you were doing this session and this
little boy turns around and gives

me the most giant hug and he was
nonverbal and I thought, I get it.

I think I can do this.

And that's when I started your training
program, and I think you ended up

coming to Colorado Springs, which is
a three and a half hour drive for us

to teach the horse boy one course.

And I came in to do that also
with some fears around my.

Ancient horse skills that were sort
of dormant and how was I going to be?

How was I going to do this?

And I think the other beautiful
thing about the horse boy

method and the approach and the
welcoming by the whole tribe was.

We actually can find a role for
anybody who has the heart to do this.

And even if you have a challenge
rising to certain pieces and

parts, we will help you get there.

And then I remember, I think the other
piece I was so incredibly attracted

to, because remember I wanted to
be the horse trainer, was that.

Horse skills were important to
training the horse boy horse.

And so I was like, wow, okay, now
I get to kind of brush up on this.

And that was the attraction for me to
come back to Elgin and start learning

dressage, which I knew nothing about.

Zero about dressage.

I grew up in the POA
world with no lessons.

I was on that writing team in
college that we had a coach that

was like, yep, you guys look good.

And so I, the dressage piece was.

Extraordinarily intimidating, but at the
same time, I was so fascinated because

I'm also in addition to being a skier and
a trail runner, very much when I was 35

started doing yoga and, I still marvel
at now, after whatever it's been 25, 30

years of doing yoga, how much similarity
there is between yoga fitness for the

human and dressage fitness for the horse.

And looking at classical dressage
and how it helps build the right

muscles for the horse to be able to
do their job and carry two riders.

And it, there is just.

So much synergy between the 2.

It blows my mind weekly.

And so, I remember also spending
that week with you learning just

how to hold a dressage whip and
my arms and my hands being sore.

And I'm thinking.

Okay.

I thought I was an athlete.

I've been this skier, trail
runner, mountain biker.

I'm finding these new muscles.

Holy cow.

And just learning about rhythm and
timing and then looking at your herd

and seeing So many different kinds
of horses and how they all had a role

just like the humans all had a role
based on their abilities and their

strengths and how they could help people.

And to see you have Mustangs
and quarter horses, and then the

fancy horses, the Lusitano's,
which I had never even heard of.

I'm like, what's a Lusitano?

And seeing the different gifts that
they had, and how you were teaching

quarter horses and Mustangs, how to PF
and Passage, I was like, okay, I'm in.

I'm in 100%.

It's really great.

Rupert Isaacson: You know,
you're kind, and thank you

for saying these nice things.

What I need to say back to you is I
realized as soon as you came out and

began the work, that you were one of
those people who could see the whole

constellation at the same time, which is
quite rare, that how the autism piece,

The brain piece, the horse training
piece, the environment piece the need

to work with the whole family, not
just with, you know, one, if possible.

And I remember thinking, I,
I, I think this, I think this

lady's going to go do it.

Obviously, you know, we, any of us
autism parents are trained by our

children, you know, my biggest mentor,
as everybody knows, is my son, Rowan,

but, and obviously you're coming out of
the same school, but nonetheless, not

everybody, Decides to turn their life
upside down in this particular way.

Tell us about smiling goat.

Tell us about how you started because
smiling goat I just need to say for

listeners smiling goat ranch in colorado.

You need to look it up It's a gold
standard place in terms of they know the

neuroscience They know the horse training.

They know how to if the
kids are not into the horse.

Okay, we're going to mountain sports
Oh, you're not into mountain sports.

No problem.

We're going to the goat.

Oh, you know, it's got no
problem We're going to the water.

Ah, you're actually into the wildflowers.

No problem.

There we are this Completely
holistic approach that you guys have.

It's very rare, but of
course it's very effective.

Can you tell us how Smiling Goat began?

Why the name Smiling Goat?

It's a great name.

And yeah, the evolution of
this and where you're at.

And, and spoiler alert that
yes internships are available.

And they do take people you know,
At this amazing place in Colorado.

So you might just want to think about that
as you're listening to this while driving.

So how does Smiling Goat come out of this?

Sheryl Barto: Ah, yeah.

Well, after going through your trainings
in 2013 and 2014 My new husband and

I had just purchased a property that
was mid valley in the Voringford

Valley in this town of Carbondale.

And it was right down the road
from the Carbondale rodeo grounds,

which is a public amenity to
the town and is free to use.

The property was three acres.

And I remember thinking, my dad had a
farm in Pennsylvania that was 200 acres.

How many acres, Rupert,
was your place in Elgin?

I don't know, fifty?

A hundred?

Rupert Isaacson: Well, it, it, it grew.

It started actually with just seven.

But

Sheryl Barto: it

Rupert Isaacson: grew to be
about eventually a hundred.

But I gotta say that the core area
was always about five to seven.

You know, it only grew that big
because, as you know, in Texas,

sometimes it forgets to rain, and for
grazing purposes, we realized we had

to rent and buy and scrub and burrow
and as much acreage as we could just

to kind of rotate horses around.

But yeah, it, the core area was small.

Yeah.

Well,

Sheryl Barto: I, I remember
thinking, Oh my gosh.

3.

5 acres.

I'm not going to be able
to do anything here.

I'll keep horses here and I'll do
everything at the rodeo grounds.

And I remember you coming to help us do
our soft opening and we did a demo at

the rodeo grounds and I had had 3 horses.

Quarter horses donated to us, so I
literally had had them for a week and 2 of

them came from a cattle ranch in Wyoming.

Big Creek Ranch shout out
to them to the best horses.

I think I've ever had.

And one is still alive.

Gates is still with us.

A foundation

Rupert Isaacson: is an
old school gentleman.

Sheryl Barto: He is.

Oh my gosh.

He is my heart horse.

And I'm quite sure he was my
husband in a previous life.

Like we are and Like you said, gentlemen
were so gracious with me learning my

in hand work doing shoulders in from
the ground and he would offer it.

And I would be like, oh, I guess
I'm doing something right here.

But anyway, getting back to the
property itself that had zero animal

infrastructure, so we built sheds,
we built fencing, we built we ended

up getting this lovely man, Brian
Cole, shout out to you with Medallion

Landscaping, who installed a creek into
Hooked up to the irrigation ditches

that all the ranchers use in Colorado.

So we had running water.

It ended up being this cute
little nirvana on three acres.

And I also lived there.

And part of the Horseboy Karma magic
also was in year two of Smiling

Goat, we pitched a there was a
call for civic projects by a group

called Brewing Fork Leadership,
which is kind of like Shark Tank.

It's a bunch of I don't know.

Business people from all businesses
that get randomly put into groups and

there's five groups and they interview
nonprofits and decide which one they

want to take on for their civic project.

And the property happened to have
this cool little cabin on it.

So I now have a blended family with two
kids that are younger than my kids and

then my boys who are in high school.

And The house is small,
but the cabin was awesome.

And the boys are like,
yeah, we'll live here.

And every man that walked into
that cabin said I'd move in here.

It was just a cute long place
with like 2 rooms and a bathroom.

So.

I, we get picked by Roaring Fork
Leadership and they're going

through their coursework and they
interviewed me for two hours.

So I have Smiling Goat running for
a year and I'm doing it all myself.

With volunteers.

So because I have kids in high
school, I'm the newspaper teacher.

I'm able to attract these volunteers,
pony club girls, like everybody

who wants to work with horses.

And so, and I'm still
keeping my day job going.

So I still have PR clients
and I'm still juggling.

So I'm basically working.

I don't know.

Seven days a week, 80 hours
a week, but I'm loving it.

Like Smiling Goat was
not seemingly work to me.

It was wonderful to wake up, have the
animals there, be back to my farming

roots with my dad feeding animals.

I'm loving it.

And this leadership group looks
at me and they said, Cheryl,

you cannot sustain this.

You are going to burn out.

And our recommendation to you
is building extra housing in

your cabin to house interns.

And I was like, wow, that is brilliant.

So we had I think on a parallel
course had approached University of

Denver and their Human Animal Health
Connection Institute, and they have a

graduate student program for students.

Shout out

Rupert Isaacson: to Nina Ekholm Fry.

Sheryl Barto: Exactly, exactly.

Rupert Isaacson: Lads, if you're listening
to this, check out her Podcast as well.

She's a diamond.

Okay.

Yeah.

Go on.

Sheryl Barto: So we end up
getting approved by D U even

though it's university of Denver.

Their acronym is D U not U D.

Right.

I don't get that.

Right.

Yeah.

But so, and we also had a working student
program, so that, and we still have both

of these, along with a, another one in
certified recreation therapy, which is

another story that came years later,
but so DU started sending us interns

and they were mostly coming in the.

Summer, because we are 3.

5 hour drive from Denver.

And so it was a bit of a commute
for some students, but students

that were looking for internship
during their summer quarter.

We were a really great
fit for them and on.

And it my younger son, Mark ends up going
off to college and James is still at home.

And so the idea from this leadership
group was your son can have his own.

Sweet, if you will, in the cabin
that we build out for you and he

can have the college experience and
have roommates living with him and

beautifully with the horse boy karma.

It's people who wanted to
work with special needs.

So they end up coming to live with us.

Taking an interest in James's obsessions,
whether it's maps, movies, or rock music,

like they would all connect with him.

It was really, really beautiful.

I think There are and in this
group were 3 construction people,

like, 1 was a high end builder who
built all the fancy homes in Aspen.

The other 1 worked for.

The hospitality group of Aspen
skiing company, and the 3rd 1

worked for a builder that did
like commercial construction.

So it, I was like, blessed with this
amazing group and then they have you

come and do a final presentation,
like, All their teams and they said,

Cheryl, can you please bring animals?

And I said, heck yeah, I would
love to bring animals to this.

So we brought our mini horses and they
did a grand entrance because I had never

taken them inside before and they jumped
the threshold in a very grand way.

So we got a standing ovation.

It was, it was a really, really cool
thing, but it reminds me, you asked me,

how do we get the name smiling goat?

Before we actually launched
the program, we had built the

infrastructure for goats and rabbits.

Basically building on your idea,
Rupert, of having the small social

animals around as part of the program.

So I thought, okay, we'll start small
with this before we bring in horses.

And this lady was moving back
east and she had three goats.

She was an empty nester.

And she and her husband had the
most adorable, sweetest goats.

So we get these three goats
that are massively overweight

Nelly, Lester, and Hubert.

And they are as sweet as pie and
The boys and I are sitting around

our kitchen table brainstorming.

We also had two dogs that were
black and they were obsessed

with the dogs and they said, why
don't we name it black dog ranch?

And so I'm like, let's Google it.

I swear to you.

I think there were 10, 000
worldwide black dog ranches.

I'm like, we can't do that.

I'm in marketing PR.

We need a good name.

And Lester.

The one goat there are pygmy goats.

He, oh my God, Lester and Nellie
were the biggest characters.

And Lester had a little quirk
where he almost smiled and That's

how we got the name was Lester.

And believe it or not,
Lester is still with us.

I honestly thought last winter was
going to be his last winter because our

winters are pretty significant here.

The beautiful thing about the Roaring
Fork Valley though, is everybody's

skiers and kids love snow days
because school's out and their parents

will drive them to the ski areas.

So the world really doesn't
stop in the winter here.

We get beautiful.

snow and then great
sunny days the next day.

It's not endless gray.

So anyway, but winters can be cold
and harsh and I was really concerned

Lester was not going to make it.

So we started incorporating more of
Lester's lunchtime is what we call it.

And Lester's lunchtime is where our
kiddos and young adults feed him lunch.

We're And we have a brain injury lady,
Miss Kara, who is an adult, and this

is her favorite thing to do, is come
to the ranch and feed Lester lunch.

Lester has never looked
better in his entire life.

His coat, his weight, like, I'm like,
okay, I don't know how much longer we

have Lester, but I think when the animals
feel purpose, it's just like humans.

Their lifespan lasts longer.

So that's how we got
the name Smiling Goat.

Yeah.

And then, so I did not hire an
employee for Smiling Goat until 2020.

And again, you know, I always say, It
really, like, life has worked out so

perfectly that I had all these years
of being and still being a PR person.

During COVID, I get this email
from a woman, completely cold,

Outreach that says, I'm a
certified recreation therapist.

I'm working for a local recovery
organization and they brought me here

from Washington and they now have found
they don't have enough hours wondering

if you do and at the same time on
the horse boy international chat and

I think it might Isaacson sent out.

Is anybody a certified
recreation therapist?

And I think I chimed in something like,
no, but I have one that wants a job.

What's up?

And it turns out in certified
recreation therapy you have to be

supervised by Another certified
recreation therapist, so you cannot

so I can't supervise a college student
who's interning as a rec therapist.

It's a very strict licensure
process with rec therapy.

So what ended up happening was
the intern that had contacted

Rupert was a trick rider with
equestrian chaos out of Alabama.

And this young lady, Kaylee was already
through college and had horse skills.

She wasn't just a rec therapist.

And so I was like, okay, universe.

Am I supposed to be listening to this?

Is it time for me to get an employee?

And I ended up going out to four donors.

And said, Hey, I have this
opportunity for a two for one.

If we fund this salary I not only get this
rec therapy person, we get a therapist

on our team, which we really needed.

She has horse skills and we get
this intern who we'll have for 15

weeks who also has horse skills.

And they all said yes.

And we have never looked back.

Like I.

I lost sleep at night worrying
that I would not be able to

continue to fund that salary.

And it has just worked out like a
dream again, the horse boy karma magic.

And so we had Brooke here for 15 weeks
and Brooke taught us mounted archery.

And I Oh, my heaven.

So that's an addition to our program.

And we can actually long line kiddos that
don't have riding skills and the horses

understand what we are trying to do.

And they, I swear to you, help line up
the kids so they can hit the targets.

It's priceless.

And so we're also going to build this
piece out further for our veteran

program and doing archery from the
ground and then graduating them to

archery from the back of the horse.

And this is where your old schoolmaster
horses really come in handy.

They, they get it and they They
end up helping the people, which

I never understood that concept.

I remember Rupert, you saying to me
when you were 1st, teaching me dressage

is that with all the repetitions.

The more you do it, your horses will
then become so good that they will

help you teach new people how to do it.

And I remember thinking,
is that really possible?

Am I Cheryl Bartow really capable of this?

Will this happen?

And then Gates, our gentlemen
horse was the first one to do that.

And I had a DU student who actually
had had a little bit of dressage.

And it was amazing to watch
how that all took off.

Really amazing.

And I also remember the other piece
of advice you gave me was don't

worry, the good horses will come.

I really thought that that was
going to be such a hard piece.

And Boy, it really has not.

And the horses we have are so incredible.

We have six of them and they
all bring such different talents

and gifts to the program.

And I, like, I, I just pinch myself
on like, how wonderful they are in

teaching other people and how kind they
are with understanding what their jobs

are, the professionals that they are.

Rupert Isaacson: You know, you've
hinted at the variety, the broad

breadth, the breadth, that's the
word of the work you guys are doing

there, that you're incorporating
rec therapy, that It's clearly

obviously not just about the horses.

You have the social animals that you
are involved in outreach with schools

that You're so Go into mountain sports
that you, but the horse side of it, you

have, you are as obsessive as you need
to be to create these wonderful horses.

And at the same time, you're willing
to abandon the horse in a heartbeat

if that's not where the kid is at.

And it's so interesting that, you know,
your average therapeutic riding place

would not call itself after a goat.

You know, right.

Or your average dressage place, because
you guys are practicing a lot of dressage,

would not call itself after a goat.

And what I love about that is, is, is
that really projects a humility that

says to a child or a family coming
in, this is not the horse place.

And therefore, if you're intimidated
or scared or not interested in

the horse or whatever, therefore
this is somehow not for you.

Or if you're the person who's interested
in, in the horse training side of

the dressage that well, this is the
dressage, you know, very important

and serious, you know, no, no, I mean,
it's, it's, it's called smiling goat.

There's something that's so
democratizing about that.

And the roots in nature.

There's also, of course, a
whole other set of skills.

And I think it would really benefit
listeners if you could go into this.

So a lot of people now, obviously, the
equine assisted world is a growing field.

When I got into it, when you got
into it, it was much more fringe.

Governments were not.

getting behind it outside of,
you know, certain countries.

Now that's changed.

Particularly since COVID suddenly
now we have found ourselves drawn

from the hippie margins, you know,
somewhat into the mainstream.

And this is a good thing.

So a lot of people now are
starting equine assisted practices.

And of course, as soon as they
do this, they run into the

challenge of how do I not burn out?

How do I fund it?

Okay, maybe the government will pay
for the kids to come, which of course

they didn't when you and I began,
but that's still not enough to, you

know, keep the whole place running.

What

are your thoughts on the following?

How do you not burn out?

You're an autism mum, still have your
day job, you're running the ranch,

you're dealing with a very large number
of families coming in, needing a real

broad range of services, not just
the horses, How do you not burn out?

And then the second part of the question
is, as a PR person, if that's your

parallel profession, what's your, what
are the like the five tips that you would

give people who are, who are running
programs going, shit, you know, how

do I, how do I actually sustain this?

What are those?

So let's, let's start
with the burnout one.

How do you not burn out?

Sheryl Barto: You know, that
is such a great question.

And I know in the rec therapy field, and
I think in most therapy fields, the whole

concept of self care is top of mind.

And this generation coming up,
Behind us is way more aware.

I feel like than our generation.

I think I'm considered right on
the last year of the baby boomer.

And certainly, I was raised
with that mindset of do whatever

it takes to get the job done.

And so, It's my, my PR company
is called Oh, communications.

It's the letter.

Oh, and it stands for ostrich, which is
my maiden name, which I hated growing up,

but my father is, was a past president
of the American veterinary association.

And he was.

Dr.

Ostrich.

Yes, I kid you not.

And but his name was very recognizable
and he was a first generation college

student, immigrants of Russian Jews.

And his brothers and sisters
are all small business owners.

Every one of them from lawyer,
interior design, construction

company, and a very driven group.

So I feel like some of it is in my
DNA and I will say that yoga is really

Like, one of my self care things,
like, I don't, I try to practice three

times a week just to, but I can only
do early morning classes and it seems

like where we live in the Roaring Fork
Valley, the earliest class is 7 a.

m.

and sometimes, like, I've already been up
for three hours and I've jammed on a bunch

of things because I have to get it done.

The other piece I would say is to
me doing the horse training is not

work and being with the horses is
also very, very therapeutic for me.

And I think like some people just
think I'm a little crazy because of

the different hats that I wear and You
know, I sleep hard every night, 7 hours

and they say, like, sleep is also 1
of those rejuvenation things we need.

That's how mother nature made us.

And so, and I do spend a lot of time
in nature, like, our, our society now

is so technology focused and being
on social media, I'm forced into

it because of PR, but at the same
time, like, social media has served

smiling goat really, really well.

And so, like, there's, I feel like.

My life is so interconnected that there's
not really separation of church and state.

But I also think because I'm so passionate
about Smiling Goat, I will do anything

to advance whatever the goals are.

And To me, it's what drives me.

It's what lights me up.

It's not a, Oh God, I have to go do this.

Also learning to delegate and letting go.

The other piece, I think when I
was that little girl POA person,

nobody could touch my horse.

It's my horse.

It's my horse.

And only I can make this horse canter.

And Where did I hear a quote
that what good is my horse if

another person can't ride it?

Right?

So it's letting go and trusting your
tribe, trusting, training them to a

point where you are confident in the
decisions that they're going to make

and not second guess their decisions.

And so, like last week,

Sunday, just this past
Sunday, I had to drive.

Three and a half hours to Denver
to pick up a calf hutch for

my goats in our new location.

So for those of you who aren't
ranchers, a calf hutch is like a

gigantic dog house and we needed
something for our goats for the winter.

And I have a pickup truck and I needed
to drive to pick this thing up and

one of my volunteers had texted me
and said, Hey, I, we were talking

about Gates, our gentlemen horse.

He had three weeks ago, poor guy,
cellulitis in one leg and an abscess

in the other leg, both back legs.

So literally, like, I have pictures of
him soaking one leg, icing the other leg.

And honestly, this is where that
term, it takes a village comes into

play, like, yes, I'm doing some of it.

But yes, when people offer
to help, I'm accepting it.

And so, on Sunday, 1 of the
volunteers says, so Gates is

now at hand walking status.

She's like, can I also hand
walk the donkeys with him?

So we have too many donkeys
that were donated last year and

so she brought her daughter.

The daughter's boyfriend and
her, and she's from Sweden and

lives in our valley and works for
one of my real estate clients.

And they sent me these beautiful photos
of them hand walking gates and the donkeys

while I'm picking up the calf hutch.

And then a third group was going
to the other location where two

other horses are, where that horse.

Petey, who you have met Rupert, he's my
master fancy and delusion fourth level

dressage horse that yes was donated to
the program and is an amazing animal.

He had scraped his legs
and needed dressings.

So I'm driving to Denver.

I get photos from Newcastle,
photos from Basalt, and

everybody's being taken care of.

So does that answer the question?

I don't know.

It's like, it's Also, I think you've

Rupert Isaacson: also just let slip
there that you now have two campuses.

Sheryl Barto: Yes, I
did leave it slip, yes.

Rupert Isaacson: Not only are you
not burning out, but you're growing.

Sheryl Barto: But we're growing and
yes, I'm divorced a 2nd time, which

I think the passion of me working so
much is, is it contributed to that?

But that's okay.

It's it's again, the horseboy karma
of the things that are opening

up, like, not imagining that
these 2 campuses were possible.

And how they are.

So we now have a mobile unit that
will go to Carbondale and Snowmass.

And we've been working with
the town of Snowmass and for

people who are not skiers.

Rupert Isaacson: Oh, does that
mean three campuses, one mobile?

Sheryl Barto: Not really, because the
animals are not living in Snowmass.

It's a mobile unit.

going to deliver services there.

So

Rupert Isaacson: does

Sheryl Barto: it?

Okay.

Well, the town of

Rupert Isaacson: Yeah,

Sheryl Barto: it's a
sister ski area to Aspen.

So your ticket is good
at Aspen and at Snowmass.

And Snowmass is the second
largest ski area in the U.

S.

next to Vail.

It's amazing.

And the town has a rodeo ground.

And the rodeo is very booze.

It's like all the people from
Aspen come in their cowboy hats

and the rodeo grounds are used.

I think there's 11 rodeos in the summer
before winter hits and the town did this

amazing event this fall called the main
event M A N E and they showcase different

horse disciplines and smiling goat.

And so we got to do a back
riding demonstration and

a classical dressage demo.

And then they asked me, do
you have other disciplines?

So I brought in a Rainer to do raining
and sliding stops and raining patterns.

And then they hired a Mexican.

Rodeo group that was the
women's side saddle rider.

Rupert Isaacson: Yeah, the Amazon.

Sheryl Barto: Oh my gosh,
the whole thing, the spirit.

And then they asked me we brought
in an equine massage therapist

who set up a booth on the grounds.

My blacksmith came in with his dogs and
did demonstrations on Horse foot care,

and he did it with my mini donkeys.

And I have to tell you, I haven't
talked about Tacoda, who you have

also met, Rupert, who is a PMU
horse that was donated to us.

And this horse,

Rupert Isaacson: Listeners won't
necessarily know what a PMU horse is.

What's a PMU horse?

Sheryl Barto: Oh, they're So, their moms
were bred for their urine to go into

menopausal women's drug called Pramarin.

So, they basically would
keep the mare's bread.

All the time so that they
could harvest their urine.

So the babies would drop and become hand
fed babies and either discarded or put

up for adoption and a woman from Aspen.

I don't know what year it
was, rescued 50 of these mares

from one of those factories.

And again, another universe
sending me good things.

I had had the three quarter
horses to start my program.

We were growing.

I was like, I need three more, but I
don't want to just like take anything.

And I put quietly the word out and a
woman who has a horse rehab program

in Grand Junction said, Oh my gosh,
call so and so, she has cancer and

needs to get rid of six horses.

So I went up with my veterinarian
and my first working student.

Lily and we looked at these six horses
and they wanted me to take all six,

but I didn't have room for all six.

So we took three.

And Dakota Prince and Leia and Dakota,
I need to do a DNA on him the're.

Some kind of draft,
'cause PMUs they picked.

The big horses so that they're,
they could harvest more urine.

And Takoda has some kind of draft
in him, but also something else.

He's the most graceful,
incredible dressage horse.

But he has that draft horse,
steady Eddie as they go mentality.

We taught him how to pull a cart during
COVID and I mean, he does sensory work.

He does back riding.

You can do anything with this horse.

He does not like to be a leader
on the trail rides though.

He does not like going through
water obstacles, but anyway, back

to the main event, they asked
us to do a back riding demo.

And I asked Kaylee, our rec
therapist, I said, will you do

the back riding while I narrate?

So, we show up with our pool noodles.

And what I didn't realize, like, I
thought there'd be, you A mixed age

group to play tag, to show the game
of tag, and now we teach kiddos on

the spectrum the concepts of tag.

So we had Kaylee back ride with a young
girl who was neurotypical because she

really, really, really wanted to do this.

So we said, okay, Mela, you
can be our back riding kiddo.

We'll give you a pool noodle.

Well, my team had brought all of our
pool noodles and you can imagine at

a public event where there are 300
people, there are lots of children.

We had eight kids in the arena.

All with pool noodles playing tag
with Dakota while I'm narrating and

I'm telling the audience who is not,
they're not, they don't know horses.

Like you do not realize
how spectacular this is.

There are eight kids running at Dakota
with pool noodles tagging him and Kaylee's

doing walk to counter transitions.

Absolutely.

Beautifully.

I need to send you the videos.

They're spectacular.

And I was so proud of our horse and him
doing this so gracefully, so kindly.

And so like there wasn't one moment
that he balked, bucked or spooked.

And that says a lot.

There is music playing.

We've got an announcer system.

300 people watching, like,
it was pretty special.

And then Petey and I got to
do the classical dressage.

I was living my best life, like,
he's doing passage and Spanish

walk and flying lead changes.

And I was like, who knew that
at this later point in my life

that this would be happening.

It was pretty special.

Yeah.

And we just got to promote Smiling Goat.

Rupert Isaacson: And happening,
these dreams coming true because

of autism, not in spite of them.

Because of your son's autism.

Sheryl Barto: Absolutely.

Rupert Isaacson: The person
who really opened the door.

Sheryl Barto: There is no question.

And so many people ask me, does
your son participate in the program?

And I always pause and take a breath
and say, Well, not as you might

expect, but there are ways that he has.

And it's been so interesting, again,
going back to your advice and Dr.

Temple Grandin's advice of follow
the child, follow the person.

James never wanted to be
identified as having autism.

And to this day, he does not.

Tell people that when he meets
them, his obsessions growing

up were cars and trucks.

So as a 4 year old, he could tell
you every make and model on a road

trip that what was going by you from
cars to semis to whatever it was.

And taking a page from the horse boy
method is let's figure out how we're going

to turn an obsession into a vocation.

How do we do that?

And our first autism families, I don't
know if you'll remember this Rupert,

but they came to the demo at the rodeo
grounds, little miss Mia and her parents,

Maribel and Diego Latino family, bilingual
Diego, very into cars and trucks and

worked at a body shop and James would
come out whenever that family was on the

property and start talking with Diego
and I was like, okay, this is cool.

Well, then we had two different
families, Latino boys who were obese.

Nine year olds that weighed 150 pounds.

I, I couldn't get them
on the horse myself.

So I would say to James,
Hey, Carlos is coming today.

Will you just help me
get him on to Dakota?

And of course, Dakota was
trained to stand next to you.

We have a giant homemade mounting block.

That's more like a platform,
like a diving board platform.

James would come out and help me.

And so there were little ways where he
participated and then one time I was

out of town and there was a storm and
Adobe, our other quarter horses only 14

to jump the fence spooked in the storm.

So she was out.

James called me, said Adobe's
out, and Adobe's a mare mare.

She's beautiful.

Loves James, like has always loved him.

Like just, so he would often
help me halter horses, move

pastures help with turnout.

And when she got out, I
told him go get Gates.

Go get Gates.

To her with gates and I bet she'll come
to you and he did and he got her and

he was so Empowered that he did this
without any help and that I was if I was

there I would have done the whole thing.

So yes, he has participated but
has been in a very Ancillary way.

And just to add, I'm so proud of him.

He just celebrated seven years
with FedEx as a van driver.

He has been a driver.

He goes in 45 minutes early every day for
seven years because he doesn't like how

the package handlers arrange his truck.

And I said, why don't you just
tell them how you want it?

He said, no, it's way easier if
I just go in and do it myself.

So for seven years, that's what he's done.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I

Rupert Isaacson: was going to ask
you, obviously, where he's at now.

That's, that's wonderful.

And it's, it's so interesting to how
we live in a day and age where really

only white collar jobs are valued.

And as you know, we were just doing
a a neuroscience conference with Dr.

Temple Grandin down at Eastern
Virginia Medical School.

And one of the points she was making is.

This doesn't prepare anyone
for any kind of life.

I mean, you might end up in some
sort of white collar job at some

point in your life, but if you
don't know how to do the real jobs,

what kind of skills can you build?

And, but now people have been sold a kind
of bill of goods, particularly more and

more with social media that, you know,
you've, you've got to live a certain

lifestyle and blah, blah, blah, blah.

One of the gifts, as you said, of autism
is That's not a thing that kind of

judging yourself by others yet run the
same, but I think back to myself, you

know, coming out of college, I didn't
have a job that was not a manual job,

whether it was construction or horse
training or window cleaning or whatever

I needed to do to keep body and soul
together so that I could become a writer.

I worked only manually for,
I'd say, almost 10 years.

And then little by little, I
began publishing things and so on.

And it gave me.

Well, all the things you'd
expect it to give me.

Of course, James is lucky because he's
coming out of the ranching background,

and who knows where he'll end up.

But the skills involved in being
a FedEx driver, that's huge.

Huge, huge, huge, that the responsibility
is massive, the just killing people

on the road, let alone, you know,
all of the logistics involved.

It's,

Sheryl Barto: I'm so proud of him.

Like, it's, it's, he has
to take care of that truck.

He has the perfect amount
of human interaction.

It's not too much.

Sometimes it's none at all.

Sometimes it's, and he's got.

Animal buddies on his route, so he
tells me about the Calico cat and

he'll send me selfies of the cat on
his shoulder because it jumped in his

truck and he's got other dogs that he
knows and all their breeds and all their

like, he's connected with like, The
pet shop owner that's next to Walmart

and it's, it's been perfect for him.

He also says he wants to start
his own business someday.

So maybe he will, he thinks he
wants to be a tow truck driver.

And I said, well, maybe you should
ride around with one for a while

and see, you know, he originally
wanted to be a long haul trucker.

And after life skills school,
his after school care person

was married to a truck driver.

So I said, Hey, Deb, do you think
Chris would let James go with him?

She's like, absolutely.

So James went on this adventure with
him and when he came back, he's like,

Oh, I didn't realize like how much
work that it's not just driving.

Like they have to load, they
have to unload, they have to

like show up at 4am at places.

Like it really opened his eyes.

And it, I think, you know, I
said, you probably should do

that with a Toe truck driver too.

I have no idea what it's like to
be a tow truck driver, but I'm

guessing like I've called to be
rescued a few times and I'm imagining

there's a lot of problems
goes on with that.

Rupert Isaacson: So the fact that he's
even able to do that and speaking of

other problem solvers, you haven't
really spoken about Mark your other

son, but just, and then I want to
bring you back to that second part of

my question, which is as a PR person,
what is your advice to people who are

starting, but just tell us a little bit
about Mark because that and how he's

been involved in, in basically how this
is sort of a tribal thing that you do.

Sheryl Barto: It really is.

So Mark.

20 months younger than James, neurotypical
played varsity sports football, baseball,

wrestling all through high school, hockey,
went on to college, went into ROTC, which

Rupert Isaacson: ROTC

Sheryl Barto: is for, Reserve
Officer Training Corps, I think is

the C, I might be wrong on that.

But it is for college students who
want to enter the military as officers.

So he went into the Air Force ROTC.

And graduated as a 2nd Lieutenant,
and now he is a captain and he's

in special ops, which the Air Force
speaking of PR really does not toot

their horn about their special ops team.

But they are very alive and well,
and he just got married to another

fellow ROTC captain, and she is a
pilot, and she flies C 130s, and I

think one of the things They are cargo
planes and she does search and rescue.

So in theory, she could be rescuing
Mark's unit if they got into trouble.

Like it's, it's kind of crazy.

And they just got married October 10th.

I'm like over the moon.

She is an amazing human.

Her, First weekend visiting with us.

She volunteered.

She got out there and helped me
do sensory work with a family.

Like she's an amazing human.

They both are.

And I think for Mark being the younger
son of having a special needs, older

brother, Almost moves you into the
older child's position in the family

and Mark is a very stoic human with an
enormous heart and doesn't show a lot

of emotions and Ella, his wife, which
is so fun to say his wife She brings

out the absolute best in him and she is
super outgoing and very, very driven.

She is studying for her master's
while she's getting all her

hours in for flight school.

They both are stationed now in Tucson.

He just got transferred to Tucson and
Mark is, he's a really deep, you know,

Deep thinker, and I really believe that
growing up with a special needs brother,

he, I don't think I realized the level
of compassion Mark has because of.

That experience, and I'm so incredibly
proud of both of them there.

I could cry

Rupert Isaacson: down in Colorado Springs.

Or spoil our other method
to keen, which we do.

Well, with veterans is actually
there on the US Air Force Academy

grounds working with veterans and
I can't help wondering if they'll

end up somehow connected with that.

Sheryl Barto: I wonder that too.

Who knows.

But

Rupert Isaacson: let's go,
let's go back just quickly.

Where I'm going with this as I think a
lot of people listening would probably

quite like some mentorship from you
because so, As a PR person, you've,

you've, you've had this parallel
track with the equine assisted work.

What's your, what are your like checklist
things that you would say to someone

who's going to go into this or is in
this and is wondering how to build it

further or is wondering, okay, you know,
I've been kind of doing this myself.

How do I now get funded?

Like you've addressed and faced
all these things single handed.

You know something about PR.

What's your advice to us?

Sheryl Barto: Okay, that's
such a great question.

I, I think, one is philosophical and
it's saying yes, and it's saying yes

to networking opportunities and that's
anything from having a coffee with

somebody to Going to an event and tabling
at an event and the reason I say that

is you just never know where that is
going to lead you and and yes, some

can be time wasters, but if you ask
the right questions And ask for names

and follow up and meet with people.

It's just amazing what
doors start opening.

Honestly, with smiling goat, it
is almost impossible to run into

somebody who's not affected by autism.

Or has a veteran in their life or somebody
who is in recovery or affected by trauma.

Like we're humans and this
is what connects us all.

And the other big piece of advice
is taking names and keeping

track of them and having lists.

And this is where It's
easy to let that slip.

And here's an example.

Was it 2 weeks ago?

3 weeks ago?

The Arc of the Central Rockies did
something similar to that Virginia medical

conference you were at, not that Virginia
medical conference you were at, not

White at that level, but they basically
invited pediatricians from Denver to

Grand Junction to come for a, a medical
conference talking about neurodiversity.

And they asked us, Smiling Goat, along
with several other Therapeutic services

to, so a syndicate was there, for example,
the other autism group and they asked

us to be there for the lunch hour where
the doctors could come out, go around

the tables and understand what resources
they could refer their patients to.

And so I met.

I think I got 11 names from that.

I would engage in
conversation with people.

And then, you know, two
of them were doctors from

Children's Hospital in Denver.

And I thought, I said to one of
them, Do you remember so and so?

He used to work in your unit.

He was a special needs dad, a nurse
practitioner who moved out of town.

And he said to me, Cheryl, I would
like to figure out a way where

we can diagnose kids in a ranch
setting rather than in an office.

Yes.

And how much nicer, right, would
that be than having kids having to

go into the scary doctor office?

It's freaking brilliant, right?

Rupert Isaacson: The message that says
to the family, it's like, Ooh, your

autism diagnosis might get you this life,

Sheryl Barto: right?

Rupert Isaacson: Rather than, yeah.

Amazing.

Yeah.

That is brilliant.

That is brilliant.

Sheryl Barto: So this man moved away.

I said to this doctor, I don't know
if you remember John, so and so.

She's like, I do.

Cause he had adopted two kids, I
think from the Dominican Republic

that were both special needs.

He drove them from Denver
to come to Smiling Goat.

That's three and a half hours.

He brought them three times and
that idea died when he left.

And I said to this doctor, so I have her
name in my, I never go anywhere with, this

is so old school notebook, but my little
spiral ring notebook, I had every one

of those doctors and nurse practitioners
write their email addresses down.

So I will be following up and
saying, Hey, so great to meet you.

So that's the other thing is
follow through is another tip.

It's like, if you have to make
notes to yourself to follow up,

it's so I have this 11 people.

So for me being in PR, plugging in
11 emails is not a big deal, but for

some people that could be a project.

So creating like some kind of either
an Excel spreadsheet or a MailChimp

database where you're storing these
names so you can segment your list.

Here are your doctors, here are your
volunteers, here are your donors,

here are and it's knowing like I am a
little obsessive about my lists, but

I really believe it is it pays off.

The other tip is the news media.

that are in your marketplace, make
friends with them, invite them to

your, see your organization in action.

I guarantee you'll get a story
and that's free publicity.

And it's not hard.

Rupert Isaacson: It's so true.

You know, it's funny as a
journalist, one of the things that,

you know, people often, when you.

Suggest this people say oh, but you
know, why would they be interested in me?

It's like because they need
stories, you know Yeah, they

they are constantly looking for
content And desperately need it.

So you are actually doing them a favor
By showing them your cool thing that

you're doing never think that you're
not worth looking at quite the opposite.

Yeah Yeah, yeah but you know, we
make gods of the media, don't we?

So I think a lot of people are
quite intimidated to approach.

For sure.

What's the best way for them to approach
their local TV, radio, whatever.

Sheryl Barto: Yeah, which can also, I
mean, it's Called tenacity keep on trying.

So the TV stations love visuals.

And so if you and also, if you
can do a little research on the

anchors, like, are any former.

Worst people or rodeo queens
like 9 News in Denver.

Kathy Saban was a rodeo queen.

I wrote her.

She didn't answer me.

It's okay.

I planted a seed.

Maybe someday she will.

Our local media, and here's what
I mean by not saying no to things.

We were asked to table at a volunteer
fair For the local public radio station

in Aspen, I was like, yes, of course.

So we go up, we take a goat
with us, we're at the booth.

And so I have a very
simple marketing booth.

It's not, it doesn't
even need to cost money.

It's a table.

With a tablecloth, we have a
brochure and I literally, like,

we print out sign up sheets.

Like, give me your email.

What's your interest?

Would you like to be on our mailing list?

Would you like to be a volunteer?

And you engage in
conversation with people.

Well, guess what?

One of their arts and culture
reporters was walking around.

She came up to us and said,
I've never heard of you guys.

I'd love to come down and do a story.

So she came down and did an NPR style
story where she was, We had a family that

said it was okay for her to be there.

She's interviewing mom and dad.

She's interviewing the child.

She's interviewing Kaylee
about being a rec therapist.

I mean, I could not have dreamed
of a better piece and it was right

before one of our fundraisers.

It was brilliant.

The other tactic I will sometimes
use, especially when you're,

So, newspapers, radio stations,
everybody's changed since covid.

They are short staffed and sometimes they
don't have time to come see your place.

So, we were part of Horses for
Mental Health Month last May and

I wanted to kick off the month, of
course, with this big media splash.

So I typed up a news release
and the news release was like.

the perfect story of what
I wanted to see published.

In Aspen, believe it or not, we still
have two printed newspapers that are free.

And everybody reads them.

And we landed on the front page with a
photo that I supplied, Kicking Off Horses

for Mental Health Month, on one of them.

And then the other one, because
they're competitors, but they're free.

Took a different angle, but we had already
had a relationship with both papers.

So that's also part of it's don't
think of it as once and done, but

think of it as building a relationship.

And I swear you bring a person onto your
property and they meet your animals.

They'll fall madly in love and they will.

We put them through the
horse boy sensory work.

Try this.

See how you feel.

See how this makes you feel.

It's well worth your time.

So those would be my main
tips to get you started.

I also, we do a lot of grant writing
and it's with our local municipalities.

So that would be the
local cities and towns.

And then the counties, they all
have health and human services

grants and, they are very generous.

If you put together the right
story about your funding needs.

And so we have been funded by
2 counties in our valley and 3

towns consistently for 9 years.

So,

Rupert Isaacson: I, I so agree with that.

And 1 of the things I think.

One could add to that is, when
you're going out for the grant

writing, do you not agree, the
winning wicket is not to say, If you

give me money, I'll do this thing.

You have to actually put your ass on the

Sheryl Barto: line and say that we

Rupert Isaacson: are already doing
this thing and actually you have to be

Sheryl Barto: Yes,

Rupert Isaacson: but
we'd like to do it better

Sheryl Barto: Yes

Rupert Isaacson: So you have to
take that risk Or first self funding

it or funding it bootstrapping it.

However, you can I've seen this definitely
work for smiling gope and for so many

others When you put that there that
sends a very strong message to any funder

saying well, they're not waiting You For
us, they're, they're already doing it.

Why wouldn't we bet on them?

Sheryl Barto: Absolutely.

Absolutely.

Yes.

So,

Rupert Isaacson: so you've
got to go, you've got to

white knuckle it a bit first.

Sheryl Barto: You do.

Yes.

There's definitely blood, sweat and
tears involved, but it's so worth it.

It's so worth it.

And I think that this.

fields of animal assisted therapy
is doing nothing but grow.

And, you know, I look at that
whole field and I think, where was

that when I was going to college?

Cause it didn't even exist then.

And now it's, it's a thing.

It is, it is,

Rupert Isaacson: it is.

And of course, now it's the thing
that young people want to go into.

And of course, to do this
work meaningfully, you need.

Some life skills and some life experience.

This is difficult, of course, when you're
just coming out of college and that's

where people need somebody like you,
a mentor to help them find their way.

And that was actually going
to be, we're sort of heading

now past the two hour mark.

And I know you have to one things I
wanted to ask you before I let you go

is can people contact you for mentoring?

Because you've really
shown what can be done.

When you have to hold down a job.

Okay.

Some of the time that you've been
doing this, you've had partner.

Sometimes you haven't.

Sometimes you've been single mom, you
know, also your special needs mom.

You've had to hold down multiple
careers at the same time.

But you made a real go of it and you are
without a doubt, we've seen it the cutting

edge of this work in the Western states.

You know, there's you there's obviously
Joel Dunlap up out at Square Peg and some

others, but you know, there's people who
really stand out as the gold standard.

You are definitely out there.

And how to.

Integrate these other worlds of therapy,
rec therapy and so on and so on into

that the horse training side the funder
Can people come and train with you?

Can people reach out
to you for consultancy?

can people allow Cheryl Bartow to
mentor them because I As you say

this is a growing field and I meet so
many young people now who are wanting

to go into this But they're lost.

They don't quite know how all for people
that are running their show, but are

wondering, and they're a little bit stuck,
how do they get to the next, how do, what,

what can, can you do things for them?

How do they contact you?

Can they, can you mentor them?

I'll shut up and let you answer now.

Sheryl Barto: Absolutely.

And I would love to.

So I can be contacted at
Cheryl at smiling goat, ranch.

com and Cheryl's with an S S H E R Y L.

I also have A kind of an offshoot
to Oh, communications called.

Whoa, communications.

How perfect is that?

Right?

And even have a unicorn in my logo
because I just couldn't help myself,

but really, it's just designed for that.

So, whether you're somebody who already
has a program and wants an extra

set of eyes or advice mentorship.

In like the horse piece or the
running the nonprofit piece

or running the business piece.

I am here to help.

I would love to on the smiling goat side.

We do have an internship program and
a working student program and with the

Rupert Isaacson: Colorado.

Sheryl Barto: Yes, you go to Colorado and
hang out with us and we are year round.

So if you're a skier and a horse person,
we are nirvana because you can do it all.

If you are not a skier, it doesn't matter.

You probably don't want to be
here in the winter, but we there's

so much recreation activity.

People come from all over the world.

We have gold medal fly fishing waters.

We have the skiing, the mountain
biking, the hiking we have, we're

surrounded by Colorado's 14ers.

It is very, very beautiful here.

Really so, with the internship
program, that's really driven

by the universities themselves.

So we have agreements right now with 7
different universities nationwide for

either social work or recreation therapy,
and then the working student program

can really be anybody who wants to
focus more on the horse side of things.

But also still helps deliver sessions
to our kiddos and our veterans.

And those.

Are they can be designed based on
your needs and your timeframes.

We get a lot, we've had a
handful that of gap year kids.

So, that works.

It could even be post college if,
if somebody wanted to do that.

I'm always willing to look at anything
and, and see if it's a good fit.

So.

Rupert Isaacson: Brilliant.

Okay.

So they give us again how they contact
you and tell us what your website is.

Sheryl Barto: Oh, okay.

I've got two websites, smilinggoateranch.

com and woecommunications.

net.

And my emails are both of those
cheryl at smilinggoateranch.

com or cheryl at woecommunications.

net.

Rupert Isaacson: Fantastic.

And we will of course put these in the
after bits so that people can find them.

Sheryl Barto: Awesome.

Rupert Isaacson: Yeah, it's brilliant.

I mean, Cheryl.

You're an inspiration.

You're also a massive and
very necessary resource.

Before we go, where do you want the future
of this equine assisted world to go?

Sheryl Barto: Wow.

Oh, I, I would just love to see it
grow and grow and grow and for everyone

who needs therapy to have access
to it without cost being a barrier.

So if I could, as I am Gaining this
experience and moving through life,

if I could help others start centers
in their locations, it would feel

like I am just expanding the services
that we started here, that we started

through the whole horse boy method.

And I would love to see it go all
over the world, which I feel like

you have started that already.

Rupert Isaacson: I, where I'm with you
is this thing of costs not be a barrier.

Sheryl Barto: Yes.

Rupert Isaacson: And I think we're
all collectively working on that.

You know, the Irish government
has just come in backing.

Certain equine assisted things.

It's, it's happening.

It's beginning to happen.

Germany's there.

The Scandinavian countries
are there, but we need more.

And I think particularly in the
USA post COVID now, you know,

as you said that there are.

Many more grants out there than they
used to be around mental health.

Oh, and by the way, the horses for
mental health week or month that you

referred to also for people looking for
mentorship, do check out our previous

podcast with Lynn Thomas, who runs that
if you are running a program and you need

some help with your PR, that's exactly
what the horses for mental health thing.

Is there to do and it's there to
help you get your story out So do

check out the lynn thomas thing
because this happens every year.

Listen to what she has to
say on that podcast and and

Profit from it But absolutely.

Yeah

Sheryl Barto: Provided so many
resources last year was our first year.

We will absolutely do it again
e I learned a lot It was really

Rupert Isaacson: I can't wait to,
it's been a long time since I came

out to the Roaring Fort Valley.

I'd love to come and see.

It all again.

Cheryl, thank you so much for
coming on sharing with us.

Sheryl Barto: Thanks for having me.

I'm incredibly honored, really.

Why

Rupert Isaacson: wouldn't we rush after
you begging you to come on this show?

Really for listeners
do reach out to Cheryl.

She, she, she is one of the people
out there who really does know

how to put these things together.

If you are sitting there scratching
your head wondering what the next phase

is going to be allow her to mentor
you as she mentors a lot of people.

If you can be even one hundredth
as effective as Smiling Goat,

you'll be on the right track.

Sheryl Barto: Thank you.

Rupert Isaacson: All right.

So until the next time, Cheryl.

thank you for joining us.

We hope you enjoyed today's podcast.

Join our website, new trails
learning.com, to check out our online

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